Transcript
Scott: When you're taking these animals who are completely defenseless and rely on us or rely on people to look after them that are in the most disgusting situations, but to be able to take them from that situation, prosecute the offender, rehome the animal, that gets a better life, is amazing.
Brian: Hello and welcome to RSPCA Australia's Great and Small Talk, where we discuss the pressing welfare issues animals face in Australia. I'm Brian Daly, and today I'm joined by Andrea Lewis, Head of Animal Welfare for RSPCA South Australia, and Scott Myers, Chief Inspector for RSPCA New South Wales, to talk about the incredibly important work done by the members of the RSPCA Inspectorate. Andrea and Scott, welcome to the podcast.
Both: Thanks, Brian.
Brian: RSPCA inspectors play an extremely important role in enforcing animal welfare legislation across the states and territories, similar to police, RSPCA inspectors are afforded powers to investigate reports of animal cruelty, issue notices, fines and initiate prosecutions. Andrea and Scott, what does a typical day or week look like as an RSPCA Inspector?
Andrea: I laughed when I saw that question, because I don't think there is a typical day. It can range, you know, from an average, boring, paperwork day, too crazy going to puppy breeding farms and abattoirs and all sorts of things. So I was an inspector before I did the head of animal welfare role, and I think that was part of what I loved about the job, is you never knew what you were going to get each day. There was always something different. Yeah, I think that's what I came to really love about the role.
Scott: Yeah, I think I'd have to agree with Andrea. I think after the time, certainly the time I've been employed with the inspectorate, I don't know that I've ever seen any two days that have been the same. You can start your day and think, oh, you know, we're going to try and achieve this today, and something catastrophic will land on your desk, and then it's, you know, everybody's focused on that. So it certainly is a job that's got a lot of variety, you know, and whether that's just addressing some sort of catastrophic animal cruelty thing or trying to help a person with their current life situation, which in turn helps their animals. So it's interesting.
Andrea: It's interesting because I think people think you work with animals when you work at the RSPCA, but a lot of people wouldn't realise a lot of the role of an inspector is actually talking to people and trying to work with people to be better pet owners. You know, that's a really big part of it. And people are pretty complicated beings. So, yeah, that, I guess, is one of the things I think that people probably underestimate about what ... what an inspector actually does.
Scott: Yeah, absolutely agree with that.
Brian: That's a good point. And how did you both come into your role? What was your journey?
Andrea: Oh, look, I've got the long version and the short version, but I'll give you the maybe the medium abridged version. (OK) But I grew up in a regional area and had always loved animals, and I particularly loved horses, and I was fortunate enough that my parents bought me a horse when I was about 12, and yeah, I guess that sort of spurned a love of looking after animals and just being really hands on. When I finished school, I went to a TAFE and did a kind of a general animal management training, and not long after that, I was really fortunate enough to start working at the Adelaide Zoo. That was fantastic. That's kind of the polar opposite role to what I do now, because everybody loves a zookeeper, but not everybody loves an RSPCA inspector, but at the zoo, I worked with, like, big animals, I loved hippos and giraffes and ... and I guess that was, you know, my love of horses continuing on through that. And after 10 years there, I moved to Auckland in New Zealand, where I worked in their elephant program, because that's something that I'd always wanted to do. While I was there, towards the end of my two years there, I had a pretty bad knee injury, which meant I was physically not able to do the hard ... because that's pretty a hard, physical job. So when I came back to Australia, I was like, oh, what am I going to do? So I started working as a council inspector, like a Dog Management Officer, doing like, investigations for barking dogs and dog attacks and ... and from there, I guess how I got to the RSPCA, because I'd never really thought about it as a career. I guess it hadn't been something that I'd really considered. It wasn't in my sort of zeitgeist. But I picked up a dog one day that had a really, really badly infected embedded collar in its neck from a property. I knew that this woman was the dog's owner, even though she was saying it was a stray. And I took it to the RSPCA and spoke to them and ... and I was talking to the inspector, and I was just like, oh, what's your job like? And he was telling me, and I'm like, oh man, that's what I want to do. That's it. So I applied for a job because he said, Oh, look, there's a job going. And two weeks later, I was an RSPCA Inspector, and that's where I've been ever since.
Brian: Amazing. How about you, Scott?
Scott: Yeah, look, I initially, initially went to the RSPCA. It must have been 90 or 91 to pursue my now wife, who I'd met on a horse trail ride on the Central Coast, and she just mentioned to me that she managed a shelter at Somersby. So, you know, a week later on, they're volunteering to trying to get to know a little bit more. And then we and then we left, and I worked there for a while, and we left and did some other jobs and had some kids and raised a family, and I think it was probably about 2006 I ... I'd worked in some industries, in my horses as well, similar to Andrea, and I worked for some very wealthy men. I got to a point in my life, I guess, where I thought I just needed something that gave me that, I don't want to say warm, fuzzy feeling, but you know, where I felt I was actually contributing to society or something more meaningful than just working for someone that had enough money to tell you what to do every day. And yeah, so I remember I walked into the RSPCA at Maitland. They just opened a new shelter. They had nothing going. Next minute I saw it was an ad for a customer service operator, customer service officer, sorry. And I was successful in that job, which I think I was there for ... it was a nine day fortnight. I was in that role for like, three months, and ended up being shelter supervisor. And not long after that, I've probably 12 months after that, I was a shelter manager. I've sort of did a lot of study, you know, in management and people leadership, did that for a while, and then it was about 2012 I came over to the inspectorate and was literally an inspector for six months, and then became the area team leader for northern New South Wales. So I used to manage a team of sort of seven or eight inspectors that went from the Hawkesbury river to the Queensland border and out as far as Broken Hill and absolutely different type of workplace that I have ever experienced in my life. You know, you'd turn on your computer, log on to your program every morning, and there would be 15 jobs, and you know, they were in all different directions, you know, of your area, and I'm like, oh wow. But look, I think it was adrenaline that got me through a lot of that initially, because it was, you know, someone might report animal cruelty because they believe the animal is being not looked after, but they may not be committing an offense under the legislation. So it's still appropriate for us to, you know, we still go there, and we still speak to someone, and we provide them with some education, and there's sort of types of animal care, and talk about worming and feeding and regular preventative vet care, and that's a big part of an inspector's role. So, you know, I was doing a lot of that, and and then on the flip side, you're seeing the worst types of animal cruelty that is imaginable, you know, when you're thinking, how could someone do this to an animal? And that just sort of fueled me more, I think. And then from there, it was probably 2017 I applied for a success ... successful in an appointment as the Deputy Chief for New South Wales. And then the following year, I was appointed, in 2018, I was appointed as the Chief Inspector, which I'm currently still in but you know, it's um ... I love my job. And I tell people all the time, people say, you know, what's it like being an inspector for RSPCA? And I said, I think it's the best job in the world, and it's because it's the type of job, Brian, that you can see somebody's terrible situation, and whether that is a terrible situation for the person or the ... their animal, but you can fix it. And, you know, there's people that I've walked down the street that I fined, or I've prosecuted, and they'll stop and talk to me and say, you know, you absolutely changed my life (wow). Even though they got a big smack, you know, sometimes you sort of dragging them to see the reality of what's going on. And, yeah, it's something I get a buzz out of every single day. So pretty much, that's my story, how I how I got to where I am. But, you know, people talk animal cruelty, and they say to me all the time, you know, I try not to talk about it, because what is normal for me and probably normal for Andrea, is absolutely not normal for you. So I sort of just generalise a little bit. People say to me, you know, what's the worst thing you've seen? And I just say to look, you know, I don't really know. I've forgotten more than I can remember. But you know, we do this for the community, or we do that for the community, so try and focus on the positives.
Brian: Yeah.
Andrea: I reckon, Scott, you'd be the same as me that if you had a dollar for every time someone said to you, oh, I couldn't do your job, you would have had your house paid off and have a castle in ... France by now.
Scott: You know, it's interesting. We deal with a lot of police officers, right, across the country. It's not just in New South Wales, and I've had the toughest police officer, you'll go to a job and we'll assist them, or we'll be talking about something, and they go, you know what? I don't know how you deal with that. And I'm like, you know, I don't know how you deal with that dead person. And they go, yeah, but you got to deal with that starving dog. And I'm like, so it's, I guess it's, you know, different people stay in different lanes, right?
Brian: And do you need to have certain skills or qualifications to get into the role?
Andrea: Oh, I don't know how New South Wales run, but look, there's, there's kind of not a formula. I guess, if you were to say, you know, it's not like being an engineer, where you need a degree in this and all the bits of paper, there's not really a formula. We've got a lot of really varied experience across our team. You know, some of them have come from our shelter environment, where they're really good with animals. Other people have come from more of a people centric kind of environment. But I guess a couple of the skills that are, I think are almost essential having some animal knowledge and expertise, because it's really hard to teach someone. That's why vets take, you know, seven years to get through university, because there's so many different types of animals, and they're all different. They all need different things, and so that's pretty key to have some just above basic knowledge, also investigation skills. I mean, they can be taught a little more easily, but I think having a really inquisitive mind and problem solving outlook is pretty key. But I think the biggest thing that we look for is people skills, like being able to talk to people and converse with a whole range of different cultures and people and communities, and that's one of the key skills that will get you through and keep you safe in the role.
Scott: Yeah, I'd probably agree with a lot of what Andrea said. I've gone through different types of recruitment. We've had ex police officers, correctional officers, ex sheriffs. And whilst those people are good, because they understand around their own safety and they understand an investigation process, I think the key for me, in terms of the most successful person is someone who is a good communicator but also is a good listener. And they've got to be resilient, and they've got to be able to talk to people, whether that's colleagues, or talk to the person they're dealing with at the time, you know, because we all come back and download with each other all the time. You know, the inspectors are always talking to each other about what they're looking at or what they've seen, or what's funny or what's terrible, you know. But I think resilience is a big thing for me, someone who's a team player, because they've got to be culturally. They've culturally got to be a good fit too, you know, because we do a pretty crappy job sometimes, you know. And look, you will never understand, I don't ever understand why someone does what they, you know, they do to an animal, but it's being able to sort of bounce back from that and talk about it and be open and transparent, but then someone who's analytical and someone who can construct a good investigation and stay focused on their task. And I don't think there's ever the perfect person, but in a team, you they all bring great things to the team, so it's being able to rely on their strengths and sometimes their weaknesses, to be able to get the most successful outcome.
Brian: And at the risk of asking you a question that you tend to avoid, what are the most challenging things about the job?
Scott: I think just the relentless nature of what we do. In New South Wales, we have a very similar dispatch system, you know, where someone will call us about a concern. They're speaking to an operator, if that then qualifies to be a job, you know, because we want people to have seen something firsthand, not to have read it on social media. You know, we we need specific, I suppose, knowledge of a job and around an animal so we can ensure that we can categorise that job right and attend within the right times, and also, if we need further information, if it proceeds to court. So it's a hard ... that's probably a bit of a hard question, I think, because I could throw 50 different examples at you.
Andrea: I guess some of the matters, where it's like aggro ... what we call aggravated cruelty, where it's deliberate, and, you know, the animals been seriously injured or killed, and just then interacting with that person, and talking to that person and just trying to like, like, you can't put yourself in their shoes. You can't ... you can't think, why did they do that? Because you're never going to know or understand. But yeah, it is ... it's a difficult job, and I think today even more so than probably when I started 20 years ago, because I think mental health appears just so much worse than it did 20 years ago. Like, you know, back then, I think, you know, maybe 15% of the jobs we went to there was some element of mental health issue. Now it's more like 45% and, you know, drug issues are more prevalent, and cost of living, and those sort of things really make you just look at things and go, wow, I don't, I don't know how some people get from one end of the day to the other, let alone having three cats, five dogs, six kids and a budgie in a cage in it, you know, it's just, it blows my mind.
Scott: I think probably one of the most challenging things is for me, certainly is, you know, everybody lives a certain way, but to go to somebody's property, you know, who lives in absolute squalor that you know, worse than you could ever imagine. And on top of that, they hoard cats, you know, and they live with the cats in their house. And you go to that job, and you think, oh, look, there's 40 cats. So you prepare for 40 cats, and you pull out 240 cats. (Wow) And then on the flip side of that is, well, what do we then do with them? So you're taking them back to the shelter, you then there's vet staff and animal attendants and vet nurses and comms people, and there's everybody involved in a response, and quite often with our work, because a lot of our work is very reactive, you're getting smashed on social media because you haven't done something enough, or someone says, oh, but they've been there 50 times. Well, we may not have been there 50 times, you know. So I think that's pretty challenging. And it's challenging with our guys to our, you know, the team, because they're constantly, you know, they're always reading this stuff. And you can tell your staff as much as you want, don't read it. Don't pay attention to it, don't worry about it. That's rubbish, but you still read it, you know, so I think then further for a challenge for me is then being able to provide that, that support for your team, so they continue, you know, can continue to sort of bounce back and be resilient and continue to know that they're making a difference.
Andrea: Yeah, having that support network is absolutely critical for them, backing up their decisions and making sure that you're behind them and supporting them, because it's pretty hard to go back out the next day and do it all again if no one's even said thank you or you did a good job.
Scott: And I think further to that, one of the things, and I used to say it to my kids when they were teenagers, I used to say to them, you know, they'd say, oh, you know, my friend says, such and such, we need to live here because it's brilliant. It's great. You know, that's a great suburb to live. And they go, yeah, you know, I know the suburb because I did a job in that street, or whatever, animal cruelty affects every single postcode, and doesn't matter where you live. I mean, we've had jobs in Double Bay, and we've had jobs on the North Shore, and it doesn't matter where you live. I think the biggest thing with it, in my mind, is animal cruelty is bigger than anybody realises, especially post COVID, yeah, because most people working from home, they they all got a pet or they all started breeding animals or whatever, and then there's this oversupply of animals that everybody's experiencing, like you talk to rescue groups or council pounds or shelters, and there's this massive oversupply of animals, and it's pretty concerning. So that's a massive challenge.
Brian: Sounds like you're facing many challenges, because there's so many challenges, what do you find most rewarding? What keeps you here?
Scott: For me, I mean, there's again, you know, for a job that's got so many challenges, there are so many rewarding parts to it. Being able to help someone who's genuinely so overwhelmed they don't know what to do. They might have a dog that's continually having litters of puppies, and, you know, we might take the puppies and ... but we'll desex the mum, we'll help them out with a bit of food to get them through, or even being there just to speak to these people and have so they've got someone to speak to. You know, can fix situations. Some of the other rewarding things for me is shutting down some pretty horrid puppy farms. I've had a number of them in my career that you know, were very rewarding. You know, you're taking these animals who are completely defenseless and rely on us, or rely on people to look after them that are in the most disgusting situations, but to be able to take them from that situation, prosecute the offender, rehome the animal that gets a better life is amazing. And I remember one particular animal in my career that I took from a really horrible situation where this dog was, she was a Border Collie and absolutely petrified. And every time I tried to get her out from under this house, because this dog had been, you know, she'd been quite abused as well as neglected, and every time I tried to get her out of the house, she bite me, or she, you know, tried to bite me. She was so petrified and scared. And anyway, we ended up getting her out, and we were putting all stuff over to try and calm her down, and got her back to the shelter, fixed her up, and then I got a photo, probably about eight months later, of that dog sitting on this leather couch, and the glass behind it was the Harbour Bridge, and she lived on the harbour. And, you know, it was amazing for me, because I've gone, you know what? That dog came from the most poor sort of situation in terms of social housing, and then it ended up living on the harbour, and she went for walks along the harbour. And I thought, You know what? That's pretty cool that I was part of that journey. I wasn't the whole journey. You know, there were a team of people involved, but part of that journey, and had a few bites around my wrist and stuff to remember her by. Yeah, but you know what that's that's the stuff you get a big kick out of
Andrea: Yeah, yeah. Look, I agree. I think, you know, pulling an animal out of a property that is barely surviving, you can feel every bone in its body, and you pick it up and lift it to the car, and you're just like, God, I think this thing might die. And then, as Scott says, coming a full circle and having that whole RSPCA family kind of wrap around them. And then, you know, watching it walk out the gate with a family and getting updates. There's nothing like it. I don't know that it makes up for all the crap stuff, but it certainly gives you an inkling that there's some pretty nice people out there. The world's not full of, you know, people that are being horrible to animals. There's actually a lot of people out there that adore their animals and look after them and will do, you know, a lot to help them out. But for me, one of the, I guess, rewarding parts of the role is just the RSPCA family itself is amazing. They're resilient and strong, and they do a lot with so little. You know, it's a charity, and so we run off the smell of an oily rag and just seeing people doing their best with what they've got and getting amazing outcomes, and it's great. You know, as much as the inspectorate is a really important function, we wouldn't get the results we do without the vet team and the foster care team and the marketing team and the animal care people and and all the people that support them. Because it's not just one person's job, it's like the whole organisation.
Scott: I would agree. I often think we're a little bit like a factory, sort of something that enters one way and it's polished and fixed and comes out the other way, and it's got a new family and totally support what Andrea says, you know, it is from anyone, from even the cleaners and, you know, our maintenance people, everybody plays a pivotal role, you know, so we can do what we do successfully,
Brian: And from your experience out in the field, what, what are some of the biggest or most common animal welfare issues that need addressing?
Andrea: I think it kind of changes; at the moment for us, one of the biggest ones is just lack of knowledge and education. People getting an animal and not understanding what they need and the commitment that it takes to be a good owner and a good pet owner. You know, it's fine to go, oh, I'm gonna get a puppy, but you've got to take that puppy to training, and you've got to have a place for it to live comfortably and be secure, and, you know, you've got to commit time to that animal. And I think people forget that and ... or the gloss wears off and it's not as fun and exciting, or, or life for them changes in some way, and they they don't consider the animal's needs. So I think, yeah, the education part is something that we do a lot of, but it is interesting that you still a lot of the problems that we see in the reports that we get are just because people don't understand or have underestimated their ability or the needs of the animal. I think one of the other things that we're seeing at the moment, which is a real reflection of the cost of living and the financial pressure that people are under, is lack of preventative care and veterinary treatment for animals. So you know, if you can get your dog vaccinated and wormed and fleaed, that will prevent a lot of things that then become bigger issues down the track. Yeah, so I think that's that's something that we've been seeing a lot of and aged pets that probably need more from their owner than what they're getting to lead a comfortable, happy, sort of end of life, and yeah, that financial insecurity sort of trickles over then into not feeding enough or poor quality feed that then allows the animal to become, you know, undernourished and unwell. So I guess that's sort of what we're seeing. But currently in SA, I think one of the issues that we're having at the moment is the drought and livestock and the cost of fodder, and the availability of fodder here in SA is, you know, people are having to buy really expensive hay from interstate and have it trucked over here because there's just not supply. And I mean, you know that happens across Australia at various times, but I guess, you know, South Australia's turn in the spotlight right now, but I think about we need to get hay for our animals in the drought. Well, the people in the floods now are going to need hay for their animals to survive until they're able to rebuild fences and crops and things like that. So, yeah, I don't think anyone's more important than anyone else, but it's certainly going to be interesting times for the next, sort of 6 to 12 months.
Scott: And I think Andrea just took the words out of my mouth. I mean, I think the key in in everything is prevention. We like people to have animals when they're going to have an animal or adopt an animal from us, people need to to to understand that whilst your life changes, your animals are for life. You know, we don't support people giving puppies to people as Christmas pets and things like that, because it's really is a lifestyle choice, having them and you've got to be able to meet their needs. And I think that's backed up by, as Andrea said, is prevention. You know, desexing is preventative, unwanted litters and all sorts of other medical issues, vaccinations, all that sort of stuff, because the amount of animals that we see, and again, I would go as far as saying across Australia is the unwanted puppies and litters of puppies or kittens, animals getting sick with parvo because they have never been vaccinated. Those sorts of things are so easy to prevent. And if you've got a good, healthy lifestyle, and your dog gets walked, and, you know, it's taught to be respectful and have obedience and stuff like that, it's part of your life. I think you're there. And you know, an older lady, a friend of mine, used to always say, you know, a what is it? An ounce of prevention's worth a ton of cure? And absolutely, I think it's right. What do they say the P and RSPCA is, is for prevention. So that's the thing. It'd be great to be able to be more, I suppose, out there in the community being instead of being reactive, being able to be out there and put in place these preventative measures and stuff like that is is a great thing.
Brian: And Andrea, Scott's told us about his memorable Border Collie that really stands out to him. Is there any one incident that stands out in your memory?
Andrea: Oh, look, I think for me, there's a lot of individual animals that tug on my heart strings. But I think one of the lessons for me that I've learned in this role, particularly, is we see a lot of cases where people have multiple animals, like many different species. They've got cats, they've got dogs, they've got budgies, they've got lizards, they've got a pony, they've got some sheep, they've got some ducks, they've got some chickens. And the list is really big, and each of those animals require a portion of that person's time and resources, and so the more they have, the more stretch that becomes. And when something goes wrong, which is usually when we get involved, it can get really bad. Animals die. Things don't get fed. Life choices of people, they've walked out of a house full of animals. And you know, I just, I see that every time you add an animal to your clan or your collection, you're taking something away from some of the other animals that you own. So for me, I guess my life lesson is, is I could have a menagerie of animals I've got access to, God only knows, you know, everything under the sun, from snakes to camels to everything, but I've set myself a really strict limit of animals that I know that I can look after, rain, hail or shine. You know, I've got the resources that I can look after this many animals. And a lot of people ask me, oh, you know, can you just take this or can you like, no, no, I can't, I'm at my limit.And I'm really strict. And I think people think sometimes, well, that's really weird. You know, you work at RSPCA and you don't care. It's like, I do care. I care about the animals that I have control over and that I look after, and so that's what I can control. And that's, I guess, that's my one of my lessons is, do what you can well, rather than stretching yourself so thin that you don't get time to spend doing all the things that you do. I know lots of friends that I've got that have got long haired dogs, and you know, they don't even get time to groom them. And you just think, wow, you know, okay, you've got three of those dogs. If you just had one, maybe you'd be able to groom just that one. But I don't judge people that are doing it well. And you know, people, there's people out there that are exceptions to the rule that can have a menagerie and they're beautifully cared for. But me, personally, I've, you know, I have to have a limit, otherwise I'd probably have a huge menagerie of weirdness.
Scott: And I'm the same. I mean, we've got one dog. He's the last one that, well, my daughter left him with us when she moved out. Prior to that, we've had my son's dog that he left when he moved out. Yeah. So I'm the same. I have some very strict guidelines and boundaries of as to what we've had and certainly have been there over the years where I remember my kids, and it was more of a lesson for them, and also to make a difference with with some animals from the shelter. But I think I looked at a list once, and when my three kids were younger, during primary school and high school, we we'd sort of hand raised maybe 90 or 100 feral kittens. So, you know, the shelter would say, hey, is there anyone out there that can take these kittens? And they were, like, four or five weeks old and completely feral, so they would come back to my place. Yeah, they'd be hissing and spitting. They'd come back to my place, and they'd go back the most adorable handled kittens, because my especially my daughter, so I remember she'd just pick one up and under her arm it'd go and off she'd go with this kitten and ... and it's taught them a lot of responsibility as well. And you know, even my oldest boy, who's well, he's 27 and I remember he rang me once, and he said, Dad, Dad, there's this magpie and someone's hit it in the car, and it's not dead, and I don't know what you want me to do. And I was, like, an hour away. I said, mate, he's gonna have to take it to a vet, but he was so concerned over it. Even as a adult male, you know, a man was concerned over this bird. I'm proud of that. I'm proud that my kids have grown up, you know, to have respect for animals and ... and to understand what cruelty is, and I agree with Andrea, I could have, I could have hundreds of animals, but there's no way I ever would.
Brian: And for anyone who would want to follow in your footsteps and become an RSPCA inspector. What advice do you have?
Andrea: Tell them to run now before they change their mind. No, no, that's a lie. I love my job. And I think the people that are here, we've got seven inspectors here in South Australia. They cover the entire state, and they love their jobs too. You know a lot of them ... we were adding up the other day, because we're coming up to our 150th year celebration of RSPCA in South Australia, and we like, oh, what sort of things could we do? And we added up the years of experience of our Inspectorate. So there's seven inspectors and three rescue officers, and we had 172 years of experience. So you know, we've got some real long term people that, you know, you'll have to peel them out of here because they're not going to leave willingly. (Yeah) But look, it's a really challenging role. And I think you see the best of people, but you also see the worst of people, but you have to deal with them all with the same professionalism and empathy. You can't treat people differently. And you know, people get really angry at you, and they yell at you and they scream at you, and you know you can't react in ways that perhaps you ... you would if you weren't an inspector. But you know, as much as it's about animals, it's also about people. So I think that's, that's one of the things. And a lot of people that work in animal shelters are like, I work here because I like animals, not people. And so, you know, you really have to, you know, think about, okay, I'm not actually, technically going to be working with animals. I'm not patting dogs and cats all day. And in fact, a lot of the time you're not really hands on. A lot of your work is visual. You're looking at animals. You're assessing their welfare needs and their living conditions. You know you're not patting dogs and spending time patting cats and having a lovely time. Part of the other part is that you know public sentiment, people expect that animals are going to be cared for in a particular way, and sometimes people don't understand that, yes, they don't let their dog inside under the air conditioning when it's hot, but the dog's actually okay, and its welfare is fine, and it's not an offense. So there's nothing we can do to make them change the way that they're caring for their animal. And some people don't accept that. The community get angry and they yell and scream. So, you know, as Scott was saying earlier, resilience is a really key skill and essential in the role, because I don't know how long you'd last if you took everything to heart and wore everything like, you know, like it was your problem to solve and the world was on your shoulders.
Scott: I think for me, I mean, I did a presentation yesterday at Sydney University for some animal science students, and I got asked, you know, the question, how do I become an inspector? And I said, well, I think you need to ask yourself, I mean, why is it that you want to do this role? I've certainly got inspectors that are extremely experienced and vet nurses, qualified vet nurses, and very good inspectors. And I've got other inspectors that are extremely good investigators, but not really pet people, you know, they may not even have a pet, and that's okay, you know, because they think a different way, and they're strictly looking at, how can I educate someone, or how can I provide some guidance, or, okay, I'm just going to charge that person because of what they've done is really rotten. But I think, I think for me, the number one thing is it's a role that you can really make a difference. And that's not just to an animal. It's, as I said earlier, it's to a person's life. Or the ultimate thing is you make a difference to the animal. But people say, and I hear them all the time, and I just want to go out, and I want to seize those animals and give them a better life. Well you know what, a better life is not in a shelter. A better life is in a home where an animal's cared for, and someone has that education and is provided with that education and is able to give that animal a better quality of life. And that's what we should be striving for. And I say that to people all the time, you know, and it's interesting when you are involved in an interview process and you say to someone, why do you want to be an inspector? And the most thing I hear is, I want to be on the coal face, and I'll say, okay, well, you know, the mines are not far away. You could go work in the mines if you want. But you know, for me, it's, I'm looking for a communicator and someone that's not reactive in terms of when you got someone screaming at you, and they are people can be just as violent, and most of our customers are the same that police deal with every day. And it's about knowing how to talk. And certainly, you know, we used to focus a lot on defense tactics training and how to do blocks and how to do strikes, and how to do all sorts of things. And the last few years, we focus on what they call now verbal tactics, and that's how to talk, because your mouth is your biggest weapon. So coming back to your question, I think is ... you need to be a good communicator, have great people skills. Further to that, I would say, find out what we you know the skills are required in terms of investigation or what sort of study is going to better lead you to this type of role, because when we advertise a position, we can get anything, and it probably goes the same for Andrea, we can get anything from 150 applications to 500 applications. It's very, very competitive. And I find too Brian, I often have people that come into the role and they quickly work out within 12 months, this is not for me, or I have people here that have been here, I had some inspectors who retired a couple of years ago, and there was 120 years of experience that left when they those three retired, I worked out, and I can't remember what it was now, but they had driven in their careers. They had driven enough kilometers to have driven around Australia five times, and they had investigated, I don't know how many 1000s and 1000s of complaints, but if you've got people that have that sort of longevity, you know something, something's right, and they're the right people. So for me, it's a communicator, and someone that really has that drive to want to make a difference.
Andrea: One of the things I think that, if people are looking at, you know, working in the inspectorate, and, you know, finding the unicorns that we find that that make good inspectors, being aligned with the values of RSPCA, I think, is quite important, because RSPCA is not a highly antagonistic activist where everybody kind of middle ground, and if you've got very, very strong opinions and views on particular activities and and things, it can really sway how you deal with people in those industries. If you're a vegan, as an example, and you got asked to go and do an inspection in an abattoir, how would that go in your personal ... in your own values? You would probably struggle and find that difficult. Maybe not. Maybe there's some people out there that could probably align those two things, but, but I think just, you know, making sure that you understand the values of RSPCA and what we do and why we're here, I think will help on the journey of where to position yourself when you're out there on the road and you're talking to people, and you're dealing with, you know, cruelty and different different aspects of animal care. So yeah, that's probably the only other thing I'd say.
Scott: Yeah, and I think you're right. I think a lot of people, they have their own reason, and it's their journey as to why they want to come in. It's the same with our volunteers. Like, I mean, we've got people that come in and just sit in front of a kennel and read to dogs, and that's all they want to do, and that's amazing, you know, like they have their own reason certainly talking about how the career shapes you. I mean, I've had, certainly, periods of time where I've been a vegetarian for six months because I've just done a really horrendous job, or I didn't eat eggs for 12 months because I did a really horrendous job. So it certainly changes you and molds you. But I think my biggest thing is, if people, no matter what they look to, want to do is, you know, come and volunteer, come and have a look and see what what we do. Because, as Andrea said, we don't all sit around patting dogs and stuff like that. You know, we advocate for really good animal welfare practices. And that's what we do, you know, we use a lot of science-based stuff, and we've got professional behavior people, and it's really about improving standards and the quality of life for animals, you know, so, and we could always do with some great volunteers. We've got wonderful volunteers, but there's never enough.
Andrea: Agreed.
Brian: Andrea and Scott, it's been great talking to you today and getting this background from you and a look inside the daily life of an RSPCA Inspector, whatever that may bring on any certain day, as you say. You really do amazing work, really important work at the forefront of keeping animals safe. So thank you for not only being here today and chatting, but for all you do and all your teams do for all the animals across the country, thanks again.
Scott: Thank you.
Andrea: Thanks, Brian.
Brian: We've been talking today with Andrea Lewis, Head of Animal Welfare for RSPCA South Australia, and Scott Myers, Chief Inspector for RSPCA New South Wales. And thank you for listening. If you would like any more information on the RSPCA Inspectorate, you can visit the RSPCA website at rspca.org.au, you can also subscribe to the podcast series at the website, or all the usual podcast suspects. I'm Brian Daly, and I look forward to your company next time on RSPCA Australia's Great and Small Talk.
